Transcription
JC Solo Ep 561 (3.20.25) - Final
[00:00:00] Casey O'Roarty: Welcome to the Joyful Courage podcast, a place for us to feel inspired and transformed as we try and keep it together while parenting our tweens and teens. This is work, my friends, and when we can focus on our own growth and nurturing the connection we have with our kids, we can move through the turbulence in a way that allows for relationships to remain intact and life skills to be developed.
[00:00:29] Yay. My name is Casey O'Rourke. I am your host. I'm a Positive Discipline Lead Trainer, Space Holder, Parent Coach, and Adolescent Lead at Sproutable. I'm also the mom to a daughter in her early 20s and a son is at the beginning of his college journey. And I've walked right beside you on the path of raising our kids with Positive Discipline.
[00:00:53] Yes, this continues to be real for me, even as my kids no longer live at home, which is so weird, by the way. This show is meant to be a resource for you. I work hard to keep it real, transparent, and authentic so that you feel seen and supported. Today, I am replaying a solo show, and I have no doubt that what you hear will be useful to you.
[00:01:16] I'm throwing it back. to a show that was inspired by the work and conversations I've had with clients. Sometimes we need to remember what the threads are that weave through adolescence and positive discipline. And that's what this particular show is all about. Parenting teens is all the things, and our kids are doing the best they can with the tools they have, the meaning they're making through their experiences.
[00:01:41] And oftentimes I hear parents talk about them in a way that holds them as master manipulators. I don't think that's useful. And when we respond from that place, it's really hard to be helpful rather than hurtful. So again, check out this show. Let me know what you think. And I hope there are plenty of nuggets that support you through whatever you are going through.
[00:02:04] I appreciate you. Thank you so much for listening. All right. Enjoy the show.
[00:02:15] Hey, good morning. Well, it's good morning for me. I've actually, my gosh, it's taken me all week to get this recording done. I've been on vacation and had an amazing time and just have dragged my feet on this recording. So, big love to the man Chris Mann, my man. podcast editor for bearing with me all week as I kept saying, it's coming, it's coming.
[00:02:46] Um, yes, it's coming. So I got to go to my 30 year high school reunion this last weekend, which was. It's so weird that I am old enough to go to my 30 year high school reunion. But, of course, there was a lot of talk about remembering when we were teenagers and all the shenanigans and the silliness and the belly laugh.
[00:03:14] And also, because it was our 30 year high school reunion, most of the people that had kids had teenagers. So there were some pretty fun conversations about what it's like to be on the other side and really questioning, like, were our parents clueless? I mean, I was a no saint, as I've shared here on the podcast, I was no saint as a teenager and yet.
[00:03:46] I don't know, maybe it's the difference between being in it versus looking at it, but I, yeah, it didn't seem as hard as parenting teenagers has seemed, being one. Didn't seem like it was that hard for my parents. But then again, I did some weird things that they had to sit with and ultimately, I have no idea what that experience was like for them.
[00:04:16] How worried they were about me. You know, how many WTFs they shot back and forth as they found out that I was sneaking out. At one point, I tried to go visit a guy who was in prison. Yeah, I'm embarrassed about that, but not really because it made perfect sense. to me to go and see if I could give a visit to good old Bobby Prescott, who was a complete loser.
[00:04:45] But for whatever reason, I was mildly obsessed with him and we shared letters. Anyway, another time for that story. So yeah, you know, I mean, the whole parenting teen thing is. An adventure in and of itself, right? And we're in it. I'm in it. I see you in it. And, um, today on the podcast, I'm going to talk a little bit about, um, positive discipline and the teen years.
[00:05:14] And the reason I'm doing this is because I'm super excited. I have a couple things happening. One is in my membership program that you'll hear me talk about. You've heard me talk about the last few weeks, open enrollment in July. Our book club, so every quarter we do a book club, and we, last quarter we looked at, read, and discussed Brainstorm, Power and Purpose of the Teen Brain by Dan Siegel.
[00:05:39] And this quarter we are reading Positive Discipline for Teenagers by Jane Nelson and Lynn Lott. And I'm actually If you haven't seen this yet, I'm doing a free webinar next month, I think it's Wednesday, August 18th, from 5 to 7, that is an introduction to positive discipline for teenagers. So if you are someone who is well versed in positive discipline, this webinar might be a great place to just refresh those, um, skills and remember, or if you're new, you love the podcast, but it's still positive discipline isn't something that you have taken a deep dive into, then the webinar might be a great place to get some seeds planted and really decide if there's more that you want to learn there, if it lands, if it resonates.
[00:06:35] So. I thought today on the show I would talk about positive discipline and I'm going to tell you an, a story. So well, and remember too, like a lot of us and I have clients right now who have, you know, done the work zero to 12 of being a positive parent, done the positive parenting things, maybe read positive discipline.
[00:07:01] So remember, positive parenting is kind of like this. broad stroke umbrella, positive discipline lives inside of that umbrella. Positive discipline is a philosophy that's based in theory and Adlerian theory and is really rooted in the concept that behavior is a result of our desire, movement, perception of belonging and significance.
[00:07:30] So positive discipline is its own, it's a thing, right? So anyway, years ago, maybe four years ago, I, right as I was kind of dipping into the teenage Spiral, right? When things started getting hard, I was at a conference, they call it Think Tank. It's where all the positive discipline educators, trainers, and lead trainers come together to learn and grow and connect.
[00:08:01] And it's this amazing conference and, and we do presentations and things. And so I was sitting in on a couple of my colleagues. Doing a presentation about teens and screen time. And it was standing room only, right? Because we're all trying to figure out the screen thing with our teens. Even those of us that teach positive discipline.
[00:08:25] And it's global. Like, the challenges of teens and screens is not just here in the United States. It is everywhere. So, I'm sitting there listening to this, these speakers. And I, one of the gals in the group says, and remember, we're all, we're all people in the room. We're all people that work with parents and teachers.
[00:08:51] So that's what we've been trained to do. That's who the audience is. And this gal says, Yeah, but If we, because we're talking about how challenging screens are, one of the presenters is talking about her son's, um, obsession slash overuse of, um, video games. And this gal raises her hand and says, yeah, but if we raise our kids with positive discipline from the start, we just aren't going to have these problems.
[00:09:20] And you guys, I nearly leapt out of my seat. I was like, I was like, I hope you are not. Telling parents that if they raise their kids with positive discipline that they won't have challenges and problems during the teen years. I mean, another friend of mine too was halfway standing. I couldn't believe it because Here I was.
[00:09:48] I have been doing positive discipline since my kids were one and four and I was moving into year 14 So it's 10 years later moving into high school and teen years and you guys it was hard I was like, what the hell? I questioned everything. You've heard me talk about this. I questioned positive discipline.
[00:10:09] I questioned my foundation. I questioned my ability to work with parents. And then sitting in this room and having this woman say, we raise our kids with positive discipline and we won't have challenges during the teen years, I nearly died. I mean, how discouraging, right? Because if that's true, then what I had been doing for the last ten years, I'd been doing wrong.
[00:10:31] Because I was facing challenges during the teen years, right? And, this is what I tell my clients and what I've said here, the messiness of the teen years is not an indication that you're doing it wrong or badly, right? It just isn't. It's the terrain, right? Brain development happens no matter what kind of parenting style we use, we embody, we practice.
[00:10:58] From zero on, teen brain development happens. Right? Teen brain development happens no matter what. Social and emotional development happens no matter what. And through. life experiences and relationships and cause and effect our kids are developing their own private logic and Private logic in case you don't know what that means is basically it's our lens It's the lens that we see the world out of right?
[00:11:29] So if you're in a family and there's three kids and you are the oldest kid your private logic about who you are if you matter And your role in the world is going to look different than if you're the youngest, if you're the baby. Your private logic about who you are, um, whether or not you matter, and who, what your role is in the world is going to be different.
[00:11:54] Simply. in that a child who's the oldest has a different experience than a child that's the youngest. And remember, our kids are always making meaning about their experiences. So that meaning making, which is not always like logical, it's not always, you know, skilled meaning making, because we're making meaning even when we're Two and three and eight and 14 and 18 and ongoing.
[00:12:20] You know, we get better at the meaning making. We get better at the perspective taking, but every step of the way we're creating our own private logic. Right? And you know this, like if you are raising a teenager right now, you hear it, you can hear their private logic, you hear. What they're frustrated by and discouraged by and their perception of experiences that you may have shared with them.
[00:12:46] And you're sitting there going like, that's not actually what happened or that's not what I said. So those moments are private logic in practice.
[00:13:07] So we've got brain development, social emotional development, private logic, individuation. All of these things are happening during the teen years regardless. of how well we have raised them with positive discipline. And so, as you know, what I like to say, the most powerful tool that we have for influencing their behavior during this time, and always, is the relationship that we nurture with our kids, with our teens.
[00:13:39] We have influence inside of our relationship. And I recently dropped a quote on Instagram that came to me while I was journaling. I feel really good about this quote, you guys, because it's short and sweet and powerful. And the quote is, we cannot control. who our children become, but we can influence how accepted they feel along the way.
[00:14:12] And when I think about acceptance, When I think about what it means to accept our kids, and this is also a quote that I used during one of my group calls during the, in the membership, it was powerful activity. When we think about a kid who feels accepted, regardless of their friend challenges, their mental health situation, regardless of their school struggles, their, um, You know, image issues, regardless of all that, if our kids know at their core that they're accepted by us, they're going to have a different experience.
[00:14:56] And I don't mean it's going to take away all of those things that I mentioned, but it's going to give them what they need to move through it in a way that allows them to land on the other side. feeling okay, feeling okay, learning from their experience, moving forward, growing as individuals, right? So we have influence there.
[00:15:25] How We have influence around how accepted our teens feel, how supported they feel, and around how we show up as a soft landing, right? Which means checking ourselves when we're taking things personally, when we're holding grudges, and you might be saying like, oh my God, I would never hold a grudge against my kid.
[00:15:45] Okay, well, then you're a better person than me because I've definitely been there where I've been super angry and hurt. And, you know, I want my Kid to know it, right? So, we have power there. We have power to influence our kids in how we respond to them in our relationship. Fiercely committed, lovingly detached.
[00:16:11] You know, I love saying that. And I know it gets, I mean, whatever. I work with a lot of parents. I just did last month a five week parenting class. I'll be doing another one in September. Six weeks this time because five weeks just isn't enough. And I work with one-on-one with clients and you know, sometimes I can feel the eye roll when a parent shares with me about challenges they're having.
[00:16:43] And I say, okay, well you get to have a conversation about that because. You know, conversations can feel like never ending negotiations. And that's not what I'm talking about. I'm not talking about never ending negotiations. I'm talking about being emotionally honest, being curious, and looking for solutions.
[00:17:08] That's what conversations are about. And think about how we operate in other relationships in our life. With friends, with family members, people at work, people in the community. We're having conversations when there's a challenge. We're having conversations with people we're looking to, well, hopefully if we're healthy adults, we're looking to see things from another person's perspective.
[00:17:32] We're looking for. Right? The same is true with our teens. And isn't this the perfect time to be supporting them, training them in being in relationship with others, because eventually that'll be them having work conversations and conversations with their friends and people in the community. So our teens are moving into independence right now, right?
[00:17:58] Our tweens are headed there. Our teens are there moving into independence. We get to give them room to do that. And when something feels off, we address it, right? When something feels off, when you're sitting inside of, I don't know what I should do, or I don't know how I should handle this, or I'm not sure what to say, my advice to you, my coaching to you is to bring it to your child, right?
[00:18:29] Imagine energetically that you're standing side by side with your teen. Looking at this problem. Make what's implicit explicit. Meaning, if there's this energetic vibe or situation happening and you feel it, they feel it too. So pull the curtain back and address it. Stand together, look at the problem. Be curious about whether or not whatever's going on is a problem for them.
[00:18:58] Being curious sounds like, um, how, so I'm noticing This situation keeps happening. I'm feeling this tense energy between us. I'm noticing you don't really want to talk to me or you get really angry about this thing. Tell me more about it. Tell me about what's happening. Tell me about how you're experiencing this.
[00:19:25] What are you hoping will happen, right? These are all questions to kind of get the conversation going. And, caveat, if you're moving into these questions, With an agenda or with any sort of anger or emotion, it's going to feel like a trap. So take care of yourself and show up in true curiosity. Now, sometimes things that are a problem for us aren't necessarily a problem for our teens.
[00:19:54] Like, yeah, it's not a problem for me to show up two hours past curfew. That's your problem. Okay, this is true and full permission for sharing your concerns and creating boundaries when needed. If it's a safety issue, you get to create boundaries. You get to draw the line in the sand and say, here's the deal.
[00:20:19] Often when boundaries, when there's safety boundaries, that are being crossed. Like, I want to take us back to the idea that privilege comes with responsibility and privilege without responsibility is entitlement. So if your kids have, if your teens have the privilege of driving a car, of having a lot of freedom, being out with friends, of using technology, like these are all Privileges, right?
[00:20:50] And with those privileges come responsibility and by responsibility, I mean, they, you know, follow the expectations as far as letting us know where they are, when they're going to be back, um, following expectations about how they're using the car, how they're using technology, making sure that they're being safe.
[00:21:10] So sometimes, When our kids don't show up to those boundaries, right, those safety boundaries, that's an indicator that responsibility wise, they're not ready for the amount of access they have and it might be time to pull things in. So it might be, it would be logical to hold the keys. You know, like, I'm concerned about you, you know, this is your third speeding ticket, um, that doesn't feel safe, so I'm going to hold the keys until, you know, we can come to a place and an agreement and an understanding that, you know, we're not going to dick around.
[00:21:48] with safety. This is a, this is a big part of the privilege of being able to drive. And, you know, same with like, where are you and when are you coming home? Right. Or, you know, if it's basic, like they don't have the skills to follow through, then it's time to co create some routines and agreements that feel like a win win.
[00:22:09] Right. So this isn't about having conversations that never end. Or that end in our teens, you know, quote, getting what they want and us just dealing with it, right? We are looking for win wins and you are the leader in your household. So please be that, right? Please be that. And remember too, like this period of time, every teen goes through individuation, just like brain development.
[00:22:36] It happens, right? And remember that individuation is them, Trying to figure out who they are separate from us. They try things on and see how they fit. And their experience is super valid. Right? I get really upset when I hear parents and adults talk about teenagers like, Oh my gosh, they don't know what they want.
[00:23:01] Or they're just going through a phase. Or basically saying like, how teens feel, what their experience doesn't really matter, or it's invalid. And it's just wrong, because it is, it's super valid, it's super real, it's their life experience. So individuation is real, and how we respond to individuation. And I want to share with you, again, um, reading positive, re reading, oh my gosh, for like the eighth time, positive discipline for teenagers for the book club.
[00:23:34] And I love this quote. When teens go through their process of individuation in a supportive atmosphere, they are more likely to readopt family values in their 20s. The more they encounter disrespectful judgment, punishment, and control, the more likely they will get stuck in their individuation process, and the less likely it is that they will come back to family.
[00:24:00] values. I love this. I love this. The process of individuation in a supportive atmosphere. That's one where we're curious, where we're listening, where we're validating their experience, where we are the soft landing, where we are holding boundaries. But from a place of, like, I'm on your side. I love you.
[00:24:22] Curiosity. That's when our kids can move through this process and come out the other side solid, right? Be the soft landing. Show up for this process no matter what your child is trying on.
[00:24:48] I have to tell you guys a story. When my daughter Rowan was a freshman, she discovered what I call Mumble wrap. So it's wrap that you find on SoundCloud. It's super explicit in your face. Terrible . Hard to listen to rap. And there her 15th birthday rolled around her freshman year and this wrap named Lil Skies.
[00:25:20] Came to Seattle and she really wanted to go see him. She's done I mean, we've taken our kids to tons of music festivals, but typically like bluegrass, hippie, you know, feel good music festival She'd never been to a rap concert. She'd been to see Taylor Swift we'd gone to that kind of concert but never a rap show and so Her and her friends and the friend's uncle was going to take them.
[00:25:46] And it was this great venue, little venue in Seattle that actually is designed to bring music through. It's a totally dry venue. There's no alcohol. It's for teens. So I thought, Oh, great. Two days before the concert, the uncle of her friend calls me and says, I, Can't go and he had this whole story that I won't get into and I was like, oh my god I have to take the girls to this mumble rap concert you guys I Was dying and then I got her I came around and I was like, okay, I'm making this happen I got us a room really close to the venue so we could stay in town.
[00:26:27] I was like, okay, this is happening So I take the girls we have to stand outside in line. I am I'm definitely the only parent in this line of like 200 teenagers, right? I have my ball cap on, I'm trying to keep a low profile, it's completely obvious. We go in and it's like five different, quote, performers before we even get to the main guy.
[00:26:56] Terrible performers, like really. Very terrible. I quickly realized I cannot stand with the girls. I can't. They're like in the pit, ready to roll. I'm like, okay, I'm gonna be in the back. And that is where I was. I was the oldest person there, for sure. Definitely the only parent. Oh my gosh, what a privilege.
[00:27:15] What a privilege to be a fly on the wall, to watch this experience unfold for my girl, um, to take in this,
[00:27:29] Whatever. This music that is, you know, number one for her. Finally the night is over and the kids are all dispersing and the two girls come walking towards me and Rowan is just like a sweaty mess with light in her eyes and she just says, oh my gosh, this was the best night of my life. And I'm so glad that I lived through that and shared, had that shared experience with her.
[00:27:56] Even as, oh my gosh, I had so much judgment, um, I was so glad to have been able to be there for her. Plus, you know, to know that she got there safely and left, you know, left, you know, we walked back to the hotel together. And, um, man, I took one for the team that night for sure. And I was really curious, you know, like, what did you love about it?
[00:28:22] What was your favorite part? What did you notice? What did you think about the openers? You know, we got to, I got to hear from her perspective what her experience was. And that was amazing. And I think we have a lot of opportunities for that with our teenagers around the music that they're listening to, the YouTubers that they're following.
[00:28:42] You know, be interested. And I'm talking to myself even as I'm talking to you because sometimes I'm like, Oh my gosh, I do not want to hear about the latest thing that's come up on YouTube. And yet, I know it's important for me to be curious and be open, especially because, especially my son, he really wants to share.
[00:29:01] So use their interests. Be curious about them. Hold your judgment. Like I said, I have a lot of work to do there in certain avenues. But get to know your child as they individuate. Be curious about it. Just hold space for it. Hold space for it. And, you know, part of the individuation process, too, is them not wanting to talk to us.
[00:29:26] And be okay with that, too. Be a quiet presence. Be an energetic presence. We show them how accepting we are by our energy, our body language, as well as how we, how we talk to them. So really, um, today, just wanting to land that, that energetic acceptance that our kids need always. Even when they're doing the stupid things.
[00:29:56] Don't hear me saying, like, accept that your kids are, you know, engaging in risky behavior. I'm not saying that. I'm saying be in acceptance that, of your child moving through whatever it is they're moving through and trust that what they're moving through is growing them into the adult that they're meant to be.
[00:30:16] It's offering them tools. It's offering them experiences and uh, they're going to be okay. They're going to be okay. So that's what I've got for you today, my friends. I hope that was useful. Um, feel free to shoot me an email at KC at joyfulcourage. com or a private message on social media and let me know what landed for you today.
[00:30:37] I love hearing about you and your experience of the podcast. I so appreciate you. Thank you for listening. Feel free to pass this show on to all your friends and family. Really listenership. Have a beautiful, beautiful day, week, next month. I'm going to be highlighting. Um, conversations from past summits. So those are going to be great, great opportunities to remember the magic of some of the interviews I did during the teen summit.
[00:31:11] So look forward to that and I will see you soon.
[00:31:20] Thank you so much for listening in today. Thank you so much to my Sproutable partners, Julietta and Alana, as well as Danielle. And Chris Mann and the team at Podshaper for all the support with getting this show out there and helping it to sound so good. Check out our offers for parents with kids of all ages and sign up for our newsletter to stay better connected at besproutable.
[00:31:45] com. Tune back in on Monday for a brand new interview and I will be back solo with you next Thursday. Have a great day.
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