Eps 116: Mindful Mamas, Shannon and Ashley are on Talking About the Power of Community

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Casey O'Roarty 0:00
Hey, podcast listeners, I just wanted to jump in before the start of the show and let you know how deeply I value the fact that you listen each week, that you reach out to me and let me know that you find value in the show, that you share the show with others. It means the world to me and to know that my story and the interviews that I do, the guests that I bring on the solo shows that I create land and really speak to you. It's just it's so powerful. So I just wanted to show up today and let you know how much I value you. Joyful courage parenting podcast episode 116

Hi, everybody. Welcome back to the joyful courage podcast, a place for information and inspiration on the parenting journey. I am your host, Casey o'rourdy, positive discipline trainer and parent coach, and I am, as always, thrilled that you are listening in to today's show. If you find yourself laughing along, taking notes feeling like I've gotten inside of your head, because it's just that good. Please do me a favor and pay it forward. Share this episode with your friends, your family, your neighbors, people you see at the gas station. Don't be afraid. Don't be shy. Your sharing is the reason that I'm able to show up for you each week. And I'm so so so honored to get to do so. My guests today are the hosts of the mindful mama movement show. Shannon Kinney do, creator of a free spirit life, and Ashley Walburn, owner of home holistic. The mindful mama movement is a podcast, a community and offers retreats that empower mamas, encourage authentic living and celebrate what it means to live an inspired life that's so juicy. Shannon and Ashley bring women from all around the world in all stages of motherhood on a journey of learning how to trust themselves, how to listen to their intuition, how to let go and forgive and how to embrace imperfection in the mess of life, they encourage all parents to practice mothering from a place of presence, creativity, humor and wisdom. I am so excited to share our conversation with you. Hi there. Shannon and Ashley, welcome to the podcast.

Ashley Walburn 2:42
Thank you for having us. We're

Shannon Kinney-Duh 2:46
excited to sound so good, too

Ashley Walburn 2:52
fun. We felt good.

Casey O'Roarty 2:55
Please share with the listeners a little bit about your journey of doing what you do.

Shannon Kinney-Duh 3:01
Well. So today,

Casey O'Roarty 3:03
who's talking today is

Shannon Kinney-Duh 3:04
talking so we know Shannon. Thanks. Okay, this is Shannon and so Ashley. It's fun to give kind of a backstory about how Ashley and I met, because it's a kind of cool story. About 14 years ago, when she was starting to have her three babies in a row, she found herself in yoga class. And really, you should tell that part of the story. Well,

Ashley Walburn 3:27
I was, really, I just started going to yoga because I was overwhelmed, and somebody said, you want to try yoga. And I picked the yoga studio that was closest to my house, and Shannon happened to be teaching there and and I really, like, it's really, truly, like, saved my life. I don't want to like, sound too like, woo, woo and crazy, but I had three babies in two and a half years, and yoga is like, what helped me keep my head above water, and it's what helped me feel like myself. More often than not, or when I wasn't feeling like myself, I knew I'm gonna go to yoga tomorrow. I'm gonna get a good reset, and Shannon was one of the yoga teachers there,

Shannon Kinney-Duh 4:08
and then, really, we didn't connect until flash forward, maybe your pregnancy, yeah. So it would be nine years ago, and I found myself in Ashley's prenatal yoga, and at the time, I think I was, like 32 weeks, and I needed a new midwife quick. And I just remember being in her class and feeling, you know, safe, and all these tears she I just have this like vision of like, Ashley, just like, Oh, I was lying. And it was like, relaxation pose. And I'm like, I could just feel the tears coming down. And she's like, How can I help you? So true. I She made me feel like, okay, I'm gonna, I'm gonna get through this. Changing midwives late. No big deal. We can do this, and she helped me do that. And so that's when our love affair started. Yeah, right. And then she became my Doula for some future births. And so we've always been in each other's lives, but it wasn't until this past summer where we something drew us together, really. And we met for lunch, and it was just that right meeting spot, and we just said, you know, hey, do you want to do a podcast? And Ashley being Ashley's like, Yeah, let's do it. Let's do it. I

Ashley Walburn 5:30
don't know what's this. I'm all in

Shannon Kinney-Duh 5:34
and but what's really cool about what we do is we both are passionate about supporting women, and Ashley being a doula and a pre and postnatal yoga teacher, and she has a yoga center here in Kansas City. And then me and my passion of just self discovery work and helping women find themselves, it just was a perfect match, and that's kind of what we do with our movement, is just continue our excitement in empowering mamas as they become mamas all the way through once their kids have grown up. Yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 6:07
so, Ashley, you went to your first yoga class when you were pregnant or when you were so we had a and now you own, and now you own a yoga studio.

Ashley Walburn 6:20
Isn't that crazy? Well, there was no so my babies are 1514, turning 13 in a couple of weeks. Oh my gosh. I know crazy. It's nearly impossible, actually, but I did it, and that there was nothing prenatal in town, and my yoga teachers were all really good. None of them had any prenatal experience or training, none. And so I told one of my yoga teachers, after all of my babies were born, I was thinking about doing a prenatal yoga teacher training, and she was like, God, please go. Like, I don't ever even know what to tell those pregnant women. And like, this wasn't my plan for my life, like I just finished graduate school and and now I have a yoga studio and a holistic center that serves mothers so great

Casey O'Roarty 7:09
and my so great. My first yoga teacher who really like pulled me into yoga as like has it, which is now a part of my practice as well. Her name is Shannon.

Shannon Kinney-Duh 7:21
Oh, awesome.

Casey O'Roarty 7:22
So maybe they're so cool. She is so cool. It's all in the name she is so cool. So Wow. And then how great that Shannon. Then you were able to lean on Ashley and crazy, switching up midwives at 32 weeks. Yeah, is that your first baby? Your first pregnant? It

Shannon Kinney-Duh 7:40
was my first baby, and I just never felt quite right with this particular midwife. And I had an interaction that just I was like, I cannot do this. I just knew in my heart, and that was probably the real I've always struggled with self doubt, but I've, but I generally, you know, take the time I need to really listen to what my intuition is telling me. And right then I knew there was just I had to get out of there. And, and that's what drew me, you know, to that class, and because Ashley was able to guide me to the right person, I you know, it was scary, but I did it, and I'm so glad I did

Casey O'Roarty 8:19
well, right? Just one of many moments in parenting where you get to say something doesn't feel right, trusting my gut right, because it's not always. I

Ashley Walburn 8:29
mean, I feel like, truly, that's my life work. It's just that, that if something doesn't feel right, every single time that I didn't listen to it, I should have every single time that it was strong, you know, like that, like, I can't do that. And Shannon said to me that night, she can't birth with me. I can't birth with this woman. And I said, Okay, let's like, then you then you can't, right? You know, then don't stay because there's something inside of you that's saying I've got to go somewhere else. And I know this gal, you know, that'll be a really great fit for you. Yeah, yeah.

Casey O'Roarty 9:07
Oh my gosh. You two are pulling me in a whole nother direction than what I had planned. I'm going to loosen the reins and say so. So talking about intuition, because I think it shows up. I think that's a really powerful example Shannon, because I think that first time mom, first pregnancy, oh my gosh. What am I doing? Can I do this? Can I switch? What does this mean? That fear can show up, but you trusted your gut, and then you found this person who also was basically giving you permission, like, yes, trust your gut. Do you find that the women that you serve, that this is like a natural, something that comes naturally to the ladies that you work with? Or is this something that, because what I'm finding is through conditioning and life experience and relationships and. Modeling that we've had. Sometimes our intuition gets pretty darn buried.

Shannon Kinney-Duh 10:05
Yes, you know, I think it's why I do what I do is because I have struggled with that listening and the more I do it, and especially through motherhood, especially with my first you know, I remember, I was that person who did all the research, you know, I made sure that I had the right diet and the right chiropractor and the right yoga, and I did all of that. And, of course, we can't control what happens. But when he was born, he was the type of baby that was up all night, nursed every 40 minutes. I mean, people would say, just wait three months, and I'd wait three months, and then six months, and then two years was when he finally slept through the night, and he just made me question everything. And so what I did for the first six months is I asked everyone out there. I looked to every you know, book and person that could help me figure out how to do this correctly. And it was at six months where I talked to a friend of mine. She happened to be a homeschooling mom with teenage six kids, and I asked her about sleeping. There was something where I'm like, you know, can you really sleep with your baby? And I'm worried I'm gonna, you know, all those things we hear, right? And she's like, she's like, What do you mean? Like, she just, it was so foreign of a question to her. She's like, if you want to sleep with your baby, sleep with your baby, you know? And I closed the books, and that was when I really started to say, Forget this. I cannot look out there anymore. This is my child. He's different. He's, you know, I have this is my journey, and so I started to really trust that and make decisions based on that. It doesn't come easy to other people, I don't know, but I think because of the work that we do, and what we see is that same seeking that same, you know, with Ashley's new moms and pregnant moms, Am I doing it right? You know that is a constant concern, and I see it lead into anxiety later when you're raising your kids, because now you're overwhelmed. I'm not doing enough. I'm not doing it correctly. I'm not doing it as that mom is doing it. And so what we try to do as we learn ourselves and, you know, stumble and fumble along the way, is to say there is no right way. How can you use these tools, this guidance, and reconnect to your intuition and trust that? Sure, we need experts and doctors and all of that. But ultimately, it goes back to how does it feel for you, and how can you learn to listen to that and then have the courage to follow it?

Casey O'Roarty 12:40
Yeah, oh, I love that. So thank you for going on that little, sure little side story with me. So let's talk a little bit about your individual like I know both of you have separate businesses beyond just the mindful mama movement. So Shannon, you're a holistic life coach over at a free spirit life can you? What is a holistic life coach?

Shannon Kinney-Duh 13:03
Well, I've tried to figure that out myself for several I never know it sounds good. I knew what to call myself. But here's what I what I like to think of it as I feel like I support and inspire women to really to trust themselves, to reconnect to their own intuition and to learn how to nourish and nurture their soul, because these women are taking care of everyone else, whether it's a heart centered business that you love so much, or an elderly parent or you're in the midst of raising kids, we have this. There's women who are just nurturers, and they give and give to the point of depletion. And so what I like to say with the holistic life coaching is that, you know, our mind, body, spirit is all connected. And I like to kind of help people sift through all that disconnection we feel all that busy life that we are caught up in, where we feel so taxed that's not setting us up to really, you know, what is our heart pointing to? What does it feel like? I like to help people sift through the mental, the spiritual and the physical clutter that keeps us from feeling fully connected to that place that's there to guide us within. So that's the holistic life coaching. It's kind of like I imagine myself holding up a mirror, and I like to reflect the light back to other women and kind of shine, you know, a light on whatever aspect it is in their life that needs some attention so that they feel more whole. They feel more connected to that piece. They can move from feeling like stuck in survival to feeling like I can breathe a little. I have this this trust, and I have some space in my life. To enjoy it,

yeah, before it goes because it goes so fast. So that's what I do. I do it through one on one coaching. I have online courses, and I do a monthly membership group where it's kind of like a group coaching. It's called the live release circle, and we eat monthly to just support each other. It's like maintenance for your souls, what I like to call it.

Ashley Walburn 15:28
Love it very nice. Yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 15:30
maintenance for your soul, because we all need it. And I love that question that you said, what is what is your heart pointing to? Because I feel like, you know, I see it too. I experience it. We're so good at being up in our heads, right, telling the story, analyzing, blaming, you know, that we're really good at the head stuff, but dropping down into heart and making it a practice to check in there, you know, to lead from there to find your presence from a heart centered place, I think, is such a powerful way to shift into being with our family and being with ourselves too. Yeah, you'll

Ashley Walburn 16:14
never regret it, you know? I mean for me that I'm just like when we look back over the year or the five years that when we come from a heart centered place, it doesn't, it doesn't have to be perfect like that. It's just presence and experiencing life as it unfolds. Yeah, and it gives our children permission to do the same. Yes,

Casey O'Roarty 16:39
oh my gosh. Side story again, so my son bites his fingernails, and I subscribed to a magazine called mindful, and he were I just driving him to school today? And he was like, Well, I picked up mindful magazine while I was in the bathroom today, and I read an idea about how I can help myself break my bad habit of biting my nails. And I look, and He's 11, and I looked at him, and I said, you picked up mindful magazine. And he found the article like it was on the cover. It was, you know, five tips for breaking bad habits, and, you know. And he was like, yeah, it talked about, you know, when you notice yourself doing your bad habit to go back and think about what you were doing before you started, you know, engaging in the bad habit. I mean, I could it was one of those moments where I was like, yes, you know.

Ashley Walburn 17:31
And now it's his idea to do it. You're like, quit doing your nails. Kid, you know,

Casey O'Roarty 17:36
oh my gosh, yeah. And so he was just like, Well, I only had time to read one of the tips, but I'll read the other ones later, and I just like,

Ashley Walburn 17:43
why might be all he needs, right? Casey, I have to go to a birth. I have a mom who's having our third baby, and she's going fast, and I know I hate to leave. Shannon is still here with you, and then you and I could reconnect for parts of it, if you want to. And I love you, and I hope it just finishes. Great,

Casey O'Roarty 18:03
yay, yay. Oh, Ashley.

Ashley Walburn 18:06
See a miracle right now. Real

Casey O'Roarty 18:08
life happening, I know. Thank you for being here for the first part, and good luck with the birth.

Ashley Walburn 18:13
Yay. Thanks so much. Bye.

Casey O'Roarty 18:22
Yeah, so Shannon and Ashley, it is now a week later. Listeners, Little did you know, or maybe you did, that we had to take a pause so that Ashley could run off and be a doula. Will you tell us a little bit about the birth that you got to run off and be a part of

Ashley Walburn 18:40
I will. So we're, you know, doing the podcast last week, and I get a text from a mom who I've birthed with two other times, and she was one day past her due date, and her second baby came really fast, and she said, You know, I'm leaving my house in five, or her husband maybe said that, and so we're just like, still, like, you know, podcasting, and I'm starting to sweat, and I'm writing Shannon notes. Like, I think I'm gonna have to

Casey O'Roarty 19:12
leave. I think I heard you writing. I think I could hear the pen and paper, and I thought, Oh, they my questions must be so deep that,

Ashley Walburn 19:21
yeah, she's taking notes. Oh

Casey O'Roarty 19:23
my gosh,

Ashley Walburn 19:24
I was probably doing that also. Oh yeah. But so then I scurried out of here really quick and got to the hospital, which is only like five minutes away from our studio, but a little bit further for the couple, and so I got there before them, and they pull up, and the mom is just sitting in the front seat, like she can't open the door. She's just sitting there and I'm trying to open the door, and I don't know why her husband didn't unlock it, you know, I'm like, let me help her out. And they waited, you know, until that contract. Contraction was over, and I said, let's go. I think we had to go. I think we had to get in there. And it was just a slow process. The check in took too long, and she's like moaning and having contractions kind of every minute and a half, and just nobody seemed like they were in a rush. And finally they checked her cervix, and the nurse that checked her cervix had a southern accent, and she said, I don't think I feel any and I said, She's 10 centimeters, I don't feel any cervix.

And so, you know, then all of a sudden it's a big rush, which kind of drove me crazy, honestly, that, you know, like barely giving us attention, like we're not even there, and then like, 15 people are wheeling her down the hallway, stat, and she sat up in like she was getting ready to switch over from the wheeled in bed to bed, she was going to burn it in and her water broke. And this girl had so much water, it was like rolling off both sides of the bed, like she poured out like five gallons of milk. It was crazy.

Unknown Speaker 21:19
Oh my gosh.

Ashley Walburn 21:20
And she just, she was great. She was great. Her first baby was eight, five. Second baby was eight, seven, and this baby was 10 pounds, five ounces. And this woman did it like an after I got there, we had a baby. So she was having and it was their third girl. Oh,

Unknown Speaker 21:43
they just did great.

Ashley Walburn 21:44
It was a blast. Awesome.

Yeah, me too,

Casey O'Roarty 21:49
yeah, yo, it's all good. And yay for good outcomes, you know, yay for good birth stories and power to the women. So amazing. So great. So before we, before we got sabotaged by that birth baby, we were talking a little bit about your two separate businesses, and the way that you both are so committed to showing up for moms, and which is, you know, something that a commitment that I definitely share, and the communities that you create, both in your separate businesses, but through your podcast and your Facebook groups and your online presence. So let's talk a little bit about what it means to create community on the parenting journey and where you find the value is, what do you guys, yeah, deep, right. There you go. Who's gonna start us off?

Ashley Walburn 22:46
I would say for me, it was like the community was building just with my classes. And so, you know, I started this work just teaching prenatal yoga, and then eventually mommy baby yoga, and that was where the mom community really started building, and they would stay after class. And really sometimes the group of women would stay after class for an hour. And I realized pretty quickly that this was actually growing my business, that moms were coming for yoga, but they were staying for something completely different. And they thought they were coming for exercise, and they realized, you know, that, Oh my god, I'm not the only one. And so I start all of my classes with just a quick check in, who are you and how are you? But sometimes moms, you know, share like, I'm doing awesome. I had a pedicure today, you know, whatever. But sometimes moms share like, real, real stuff that's going on in their lives, and then all of a sudden, you know, you see the community build, and people you know, come over and watch their kids or share exchange numbers and so, you know, I started my online community just from that, from this group of women who were staying after and most of them were texting me and emailing me and Facebooking me every day questions, or, Hey, can you hook me up with Shannon? Or, you know, there was that girl in class. And so I just literally thought this statement one day, like, surely they can just answer each other's questions. And that's what has happened. And so now I have a big, you know, social media following and, and it's just support, you know, it's literally like, I don't know what to do about vaccinations. I don't know what to do about circumcision. I'm thinking about weaning my baby. You know? I mean everything my husband's driving me crazy today, my mother in law, my mother in law, my mother in law, yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 24:57
man, which one day we will be? The mother in law,

Ashley Walburn 25:02
which is Amen. So, you know, for me, the building of the community is now what is sustaining my business, but also, like, it's like, we really have a community of women in Kansas City that is different than it was just kind of because of this Facebook group. I mean, it's, it's very, very interesting. So I'm grateful for it, and grateful I thought, surely they can answer each other's questions and I don't have to be the only one, yeah.

Shannon Kinney-Duh 25:30
And I think what we've noticed, so her Facebook group, O mamas, is the one that kind of was born from her classes, and now it's really, I mean, wouldn't you say a majority are new moms? Yeah, and it's, or not just new moms, but maybe just had a baby, second or younger moms, but you're in that, like, really, those specific questions, like, please, like, just make sure I'm not going insane here. And how do I get through this, the these sleepless nights? And I think what we're finding with our mindful mama movement community that's growing from the start of this podcast, but also merging both of our other Online Communities, is now it's kind of a settling. We're kind of beyond that, like newborn stage, but now it's like you're in the either the thick of raising your children, or we're seeing also moms and grandmothers who may have raised their children, or may want to, you know, be more connected to their grandkids. But it's it's really just now looking at yourself a little bit. How can I enjoy this a little bit more? How can I slow down, and how can I find other moms who are in that same boat and who I can relate to, and it's just, it's that's the greatest thing about especially these communities online and locally, is that you realize you're not the only one going through whatever it is you're going through, whatever stage you're going through. And that's really what's been awesome about it. Yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 26:55
yeah, Ashley, I love that starting question of questions of who are you and how are you? I love that invitation for you know, it's such a different like, who are you? How old are your kids? Right? I mean, it really like, I feel even my body going like, kind of dropping a little. Who are you, for sure, how are you? Like? We're here to be real and be together. And that's so great. And Shannon, you know, talking about that idea of mamas supporting mamas, right? I think that I've experienced the same thing in the groups, Facebook and otherwise that I support is I ultimately, I don't want to be, I don't want, I mean, I want people to come to me, listeners and work with me, yes, but the goal is, and the come from is, there's so much wisdom that lives inside of us, and how do we begin to peel back, you know, the conditioning and the experiences that we've had and the, you know, created beliefs over time that are getting in our that are blocking us from that wisdom. So I've really pulled back, like you were saying. I've pulled back from being the first one to respond like I don't feel like I need, I want to be the first one to respond when people post questions, because I want the community to recognize like I have something of value to to share here. And then you know that place, that virtual place, also being able to take that into their life, and the moments that are really challenging with their kids, having those moments of oh, I have I have value here. I can drop into my wisdom and know what how to be in this moment. Yeah, instead of, oh, where's that script, or where's that PDF? Or, you know, like, No, you don't need that. It's a crutch. Sometimes it's a stepping it can feel like a stepping stone to have some tweaks in language or whatever. But, you know, ultimately, it's not what we do, it's how we be

Shannon Kinney-Duh 29:00
well, and it's empowering when you've been through that stage and you had no clue what you were doing, and you were the one asking the questions, and then you've moved beyond it, and now it's like, oh my gosh, I might know something that maybe you have that opportunity to share it, you know, is really huge. And also what I find, especially in our mindful mama and then my other community is that there's things that we would say online and feel comfortable doing it that we wouldn't in person, you know, that kind of does strip down that, like surface, you know, that really can make it feel a little too vulnerable. I think sometimes for people to share, like, you mean, you really don't know what you're you're doing. Like, no, I really don't, but it's there's just kind of this openness, I think that people feel they can get to that deeper place sometimes in these groups.

Casey O'Roarty 29:52
Yeah, I love that, because so often we're talking about how that barrier, when that barrier goes. A way people can show up so hurtful, right? But it also has a it has a light side where it actually becomes Yes, because we have this vast, like space between ourselves and people we're communicating with. It also allows us, you know, thought time and like you were just talking about Shannon, the ability to go deeper. So thank you. Yes,

Ashley Walburn 30:25
for the most part, we see that. I mean, we see the going deeper and the like moms really supporting and being thoughtful and sharing wisdom and resources most of the time. And there, there is, there is some nasty calf out there, you know, too, but I have a really strong belief also, you know, I'll get like, why don't you kick her out? And I believe that she needs the support and has and like she, she needs the support and maybe one of these things will change everything for her, right? You know that I don't think anybody's trying to be me. They don't know that they're being hurtful and harmful.

Casey O'Roarty 31:09
They're doing the best they can with the tools they have, and that that

Ashley Walburn 31:13
Mama and that Mama's babies really needs this group maybe more than US that are just being sweet and supportive, right? No. What

Casey O'Roarty 31:23
are you noticing as themes that show up in your communities lately?

Shannon Kinney-Duh 31:32
Well, I know in the omama group, I tend to see the theme of just, Am I doing it right? Yeah, am I doing this right? Or is there a right way? It's

Ashley Walburn 31:41
kind of scary questions. You know what I mean, like, Oh, my God, am I Oh my God, should I? Is this normal? Is this normal? Is this normal? And, yeah, I would agree that, you know, like, am I unraveling? Am I okay? Is this baby normal? Is this rash normal? I think back, you know, my youngest is 12, and, like, what did I do when I had these questions at 5am and I didn't have a Facebook group? What did I do? And I don't know.

Casey O'Roarty 32:12
I mean, I looked it up in my Dr Sears baby book, because there was the answer to everything in that book.

Ashley Walburn 32:19
And, I mean, this is crazy, but, like, I had a parents magazine subscription, and I kept the parents magazines and, I mean, there was a lot of resources in there, and so I would dig through them. I mean, I remember keeping, like, parents magazines, like, near my bed, and like, you know, you're digging through your

Shannon Kinney-Duh 32:38
parents Google the old days, yeah, yeah. In our mindful mama movement group and in the live freely circle, I see a lot of, you know, self discovery questions, like, you know, what am I outside of mom? How do I find, you know, this balance or flow in supporting you know, my work and my personal interests, my creative pursuits, while still being a good mom. Can I do both? I see a lot of, you know, if I do 1am, I taking away from the other? And kind of, you know, learning how to release that guilt, learning how to trust ourselves. And also just, I think, just getting that validation. You know that our lives aren't perfect the moment we're vulnerable and we share, like, oh gosh, I had this just horrible day. Yeah, then everyone it gives them permission to share and just, you know, I think people are seeking to be real.

Ashley Walburn 33:35
Yeah, it's my favorite thing about the mindful mama movement group is that everybody and there is, they'll share articles. And you're that, you know, I listen to this podcast today, and this was so helpful for me with my two year olds tantrums. Thought you guys might like that. It is really like, help a sister out. Yeah, awesome feeling. And so, much, yeah, and so it's just interesting, like they all end up having a life of their own.

Shannon Kinney-Duh 34:04
Other themes, oh, go ahead. Well, I

Casey O'Roarty 34:06
just wanted to respond, Shannon, to what you were saying about those questions about what it what is life beyond the role of mother? And I just got this visual because I'll often, you know, refer to being in the weeds, especially when our kids are so little, you know, and maybe there's multiple under five, and so I just got this visual of like they're in the weeds, so like tall grass, and then a mom head popping out, like, wait a minute,

there's a horizon, there's a sky, like there's all this other and then backdropping back into the moment of motherhood. But I think that what, yeah, just came to me. I love it, but also just, you know, recognizing the the. Step to even like being in that question, being in the question of, you know, oh, there's actually more life going on. There's more life available to me. There's you know, and not having necessarily answers to those questions, but just being with that question is such a big it's movement. It's a step towards expansion, I guess is what came up for me. And I think that's a really exciting place to be.

Shannon Kinney-Duh 35:29
It is exciting, and I think that it's a really special time right now so many women and we still do it, but I see a lot of women, even in my free spirit community, who have raised their children and now they're like, they just sent off their last one to college. And it's kind of this, you know, another stage which is now what, and I think that a lot of us, you know, kind of looking to be intentional with our parenting, is to say we don't have to wait until then. How can we nourish and nurture the sight of us so that we can stick our head out a little bit more and see the horizon and see the beauty in those weeds? But you know, to see which ones we need to start pulling so that we can make more space for whatever, you know, is ready to bloom inside of us, and I think that's, that is what I'm passionate about, because I don't think we have to choose, you know? I think we can do both, and we become better mothers when we're nourishing and nurturing that side of us that needs tending right. Love it.

Ashley Walburn 36:35
Amen girl,

Shannon Kinney-Duh 36:39
and I was going to say that the other theme I see is this, this desire for simplicity, this desire for a more minimal, minimalist way of living, this desire to do less activity, this desire to carve our own path and not get swept up by what society says we should be doing with these activities and all this stuff With our kids, and I see that time and again this like need to declutter and let go, and that's so exciting, because you can't have one without the other. If your life is so completely filled and you're you're swept up by those activities and all the toys and all the mess, well, it's really hard to then make the space to feel that you can, you know, take good care of yourself along being a mom. So I see a lot of those questions on, how do I start this decluttering project, and how do I say no to these activities? And how can I do less and still feel like I'm doing enough?

Casey O'Roarty 37:34
Love it. I think that another like right now, what's alive in one of the communities that I'm running, is that I'm finding myself like, Okay, I'm gonna respond to this mom and to the whole group by giving permission that she doesn't have to solve all of her kids problems. Yes, right? Like that, to me, is a declutter as well. Just like, like, giving permission, you know, you don't, we don't have to, and listeners, we don't have to, we don't have to solve all of our kids' problems. In fact, we're actually doing them a disservice, and parts of their personality that might be currently rubbing, kind of giving us a little rub of scratchy scratch, like, I gotta nip this in the bud, like, do you? I mean, I don't know that. I think there's a dark side and a light side to all the different personality tendencies, and typically they're speaking to us in code anyway. So like, what's going on deeper? And this is a whole nother podcast.

Ashley Walburn 38:35
It's a whole I know I'm like, my mind spinning good

Shannon Kinney-Duh 38:39
reminder for ourselves too, because I'm one of those overthinkers, and I try to fix things, and I think, oh no, here's another thing I need to think about fix. And then you add three kids and a husband in the mix, and you're like, wait a minute. It's just it. That's where the worry and the overwhelm and the maxed out really happens. So you're right, that decluttering of our mind. It's like, oh my gosh. Maybe I don't have to fix anything. Maybe I need to relax. Maybe I need to allow maybe I just need to, you know, to relax. There's some I don't know where this is from, but a friend of mine, this has helped me so much. She said she heard it somewhere. Basically, when stuff goes on with our kids, you know that initial reaction is to hear the theme music from Jaws Donna, and you're like, when you start to hear that and yourself, you're like, oh my gosh, what do I need to do? There's a shark, you know? And so that, I'm swear I go to that song. I'm like, Okay, I don't need the jaws music right now, right? No. Shark is gonna be

Casey O'Roarty 39:33
fine. Love it. Love it. So my last question for you gals is, what does joyful courage mean to you?

Ashley Walburn 39:44
Joyful courage, I think you know, for me, like the biggest part of what I do, whether it is at a birth or, you know, meeting one on one with mothers, is really. Just like finding your power, stepping into your own strength, and not giving a shit, anything, a thought about what anybody else thinks like, what do I really want? What does my baby really want? My baby, who's 23 and go from like my soul, like I know this is right, and that when I feel grounded and I feel like myself, then I make decisions that are mine, and I'm not going to regret being tucked into an intervention or whatever, because it was my decision. I was informed, and it was mine, and then that's a blast, honestly. So for me, when I feel like myself, then I feel braver to do everything. And really it gives my kids permission to do the same. So that's joyful courage to me.

Casey O'Roarty 40:58
Yes,

Shannon Kinney-Duh 40:59
I ditto that, and I guess I would just add that having a playful just making sure we're really following our heart, our instinct, as Ashley said, and looking at taking risks with a sense of adventure. That's how I see my daily life. If I can just look at this without the jaws music, when I can stay curious, stay playful and light, not always that way, because we can get so dang serious about this parenting. Gosh, I know I want to just look at taking risk and being brave with a sense of adventure that's joyful, courage.

Casey O'Roarty 41:46
Love, yeah, we got our little aerial on. Yay. Thanks, gals. So where can listeners? Let's just make sure that you get a little shout out. We've talked about your groups, but you can mention them again. Where can listeners find you and follow your work

Ashley Walburn 42:01
so you can find me at home, holistic.com and then also my Facebook group is O mamas, and there's several like offshoots of it, capital O, M, A, M, A S. And then Shannon and I together are the podcast the mindful mama movement, and then we also have a Facebook page and group with the same name. And then Shannon,

Shannon Kinney-Duh 42:28
I'm at a free spirit life.com Yes. Yay. Awesome.

Casey O'Roarty 42:35
Well, thank you so much, gals, this was so fun. It was so fun. Thank you.

Shannon Kinney-Duh 42:39
Thank you Casey.

Casey O'Roarty 42:49
Oh, again. Thank you to Ashley and Shannon for taking the time to be on with me. Go check out their show. You will love it. So yeah, I am really excited because at the end of this week, I will be in Boise, Idaho, Boise Idaho, doing my final mother's journey workshop for 2017 if you are anywhere in the vicinity and interested in going, I would love to have you there. Go to www dot joyful courage.com/ mother's journey, and you will be able to register to be a part of that workshop. It's going to be so much fun. November 4, nine to three. Muse studio. It's a yoga studio in downtown Boise. That's where we're going to be, and I'd love to have you there. Also, also, also, also, if you've been following me on Instagram or other spaces, you have heard me talk about my daily intention cards. They Well, I'm hoping that by the time this airs, I still have a few, and I'm not sold out, they are going like hotcakes. And what they are is a deck of 31 cards. And the purpose, the reason that I created them, was for you to have one more tool to remind you to be right, to be in your intention, to be in your kindness, to be loving, to be present, to be the things that we want to evoke and create in sight of our relationships with the people that we love. And so my hope is these cards can be one more tool to support you in doing that, and they are making their way across the country. It's really, really exciting to see all the people that are showing up who are interested in really taking parenting to the next level and really owning and stepping into personal responsibility around. Ways of being, because that's really what this thing is all about, right? I listened to one of Oprah's Super Soul Sunday conversation podcasts, and it was Oprah and Eckhart Tolle. And, I mean, I took two pages of notes. It was so powerful. And, you know, I'm finding, gosh, resistance is futile, right? Resistance creates suffering. So, you know, we get so worked up about the ways that our children are showing up, myself included. Hello. If anyone listened to last week's show, you know I'm talking about we're in resistance. We don't always realize that we're in resistance. We can absolutely feel the suffering. Suffering shows up as resentment, as irritation, as embarrassment, as sadness, as anger as fear, right? That's suffering. And what we can start to do, what I'm in the practice of beginning to do and learning to do and creating in my life, what we can do is recognize, oh, I'm suffering right now. What am I resisting? And what can I let go of? What can I step into that would inform and inspire this relationship that I'm in? So the intention cards are designed to do just that for you. If you are interested in getting your own deck, you can go to my website, joyful courage.com backslash or forward slash or whatever. The slash intention cards all one word, okay. Joyful courage.com/intention cards all one word, and you can get your own deck.

Thank you for being the amazing listeners that you are. Thank you for showing up in our community. Thank you, Chris Mann, for your production support of this podcast. I so appreciate you, friends. You can follow me. You can follow me on Facebook, on Instagram, you can join the live and love with joyful courage, Facebook group that is a safe place and supportive place for celebrating and sharing the struggles on the parenting journey. I'm happy to have you there. Just click the Join button and you're in big love to all of you. If you have any questions or feedback, you could always reach out to me. Casey at joyful courage.com. Don't forget that I am also available for coaching. If you feel like one on one, coaching is what you need to go next level to elevate in your practice of parenting and being in the world, reach out. Reach out with an email. Let me know you're interested, and we can see if it's a good fit. Have a beautiful, beautiful day, my friends. Happy Halloween. Is it so crazy that tomorrow is November? Oh my gosh. Big, big. Love to each and every one of you. Have a beautiful, beautiful day

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