Eps 324: Mental Health for Moms with Charlotte Avery

What does Joyful Courage mean to you?

Joyful Courage to me means being able to find the joy even in the scary moments. My son is going to be the first to leave home and go to college and as nervous as I feel, just knowing I’m going to be a courageous mom  letting him spread his wings and fly because it takes courage to do that, but also finding the joy in his journey and my journey as we go down this path together.

 

 

PARENTING FOR THE SEASON YOU’RE IN

Parenting for The Season You’re In is a program for parents who are looking for a deeper understanding of the challenges they are facing, how they may be contributing to the challenges, and tools and strategies for problem solving. Most importantly, this community is about experiencing more joy on the parenting journey. 

Join so many other parents in finding their Joyful Courage as we walk the sometimes mild, sometimes wild parenting path. No matter the season of parenting you are in today, this program is designed to give you what you need to be the parent you want to be.

This is a 6 week class that starts May 10th and goes through June 14th from 5-7 PT over Zoom.

For more information, go to besproutable.com/teens/positive-discipline-classes

 

Positive Discipline Association Conference

Join us in person for the 2022 Positive Discipline Conference which features presentations for educators, clinicians, and parents. Spend the day developing Positive Discipline tools for home and school, or to support others through your coaching, consulting, or counseling practice.

Learn more at positivediscipline.org

 

Teaching Parenting The Positive Discipline Way

Teaching Parenting The Positive Discipline Way is a two day, in-person workshop designed to support participants in learning all they need to teach the Parenting the Positive Discipline Way curriculum. Developed by Lynn Lott and Jane Nelsen, this program provides a step-by-step approach to starting and leading experientially based parenting groups and classes. This curriculum can stand alone or can offer significant enhancement to other parenting programs; it emphasizes experiential activities that reach the heart to inspire deeper understanding and change.

Grounded in the work of Jane Nelsen and Adlerian Theory, Positive Discipline centers relationship, encouragement and the practice of life skills, with an overarching theme of trusting the process and recognizing mistakes as opportunities to learn and grow.

This course takes place IN PERSON Fri May 27th – Sat May 28th

8:30am – 5pm ET in McLean, VA

Learn more at besproutable.com/parent-educators

 

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Transcription

Charlotte Avery 0:00
When your children start to mirror your bad behavior, oh, Casey, it shook me in a way that I cannot even tell you, and at that point, I said to myself, I have to do better. I have to really dig deep and discover why am I doing this? Where is this coming from? What is the pattern? What are the deep root that this ugly behavior in me? Where does this come from? And I had to do my own work.

Casey O'Roarty 0:35
Hey, friends, welcome to the joyful courage podcast, a place where we tease apart the challenges and nuances of parenting through the adolescent years. I am your host. Casey overrti, I am a positive discipline lead trainer. I am the adolescent lead sproutable, a company that represents not only the growth of children, but also the journey and evolution that we all go on as parents. I am also a parent of two teenagers, myself here in the beautiful Pacific Northwest, joyful courage is all about grit growth on the parenting journey, relationships that provide a sense of connection and meaning and the influential tools that support everyone in being their best selves. I am so happy to be back here with you this week. Keep those reviews coming, my friends, every time you jump into Apple podcasts and share that you love the show, it means so much, not only to me personally, but it also makes sure that the show is seen by others. So I'm just gonna share. I've got a couple new reviews from early in April. Jess Seattle, dance fitness wrote, thanks, Casey, I was so thankful to find your podcast in the last six months since my tween turned into a full on teen, went back to in person school and started navigating middle school for the first time as an eighth grader since the pandemic took away the early years of middle school, he got into all kinds of ish pretty darn quick that I really wasn't prepared for your podcast has been so helpful in building my toolbox as a parent of a teen. Thank you. You are so welcome. Jess also from Mara, finally, a podcast targeting parents of teens. Thank you for being specific to parenting teenagers. This podcast has been so helpful. Finally, a loving way to be supportive, using respect. Yes. Thank you. Thank you, ladies for leaving the reviews. Thanks to everybody who's left reviews. If you haven't left a review for me yet in Apple podcasts, if you could do that, it would mean so much. Come on, and maybe it'll even get read on the show. We are over 1 million downloads and 300 plus episodes strong, and you have taken us, the show to the top 1% of podcasts worldwide. I so appreciate you. Before I introduce my guest, we're back to interviews. Before I interview my guest, I want to be sure that you know what's happening here this spring with me and the opportunities that are available for you to learn and grow. So as many of you know, the boundaries workshop was last week. So good. Thank you to everyone who showed up. I shared about my upcoming positive discipline class that I'm running only for parents of tweens and teens during the workshop, and now I'm gonna share it here on the podcast. So yes, parenting for the season you're in. This is my six week class full of community and experiential learning that is practical for all of you that want to be parenting your teens and tweens with positive discipline. It's a great refresher course for anyone who may have already taken a positive discipline class, maybe when your kids were younger, and now you're a bit miffed on how to keep it going in the adolescent years. Learning is good people, and we have to stay in the practice, to stay in the practice, right? If you know what I mean by that, we have to continue to marinate in this work, to really be integrating it into our lives. This is a live, interactive class offered over six weeks. If you love this podcast, you for sure want to sign up for this class. This is where we bring the tools and the concepts that I talk about here on the show. We bring them to life. We bring them to life. We start may 10. The classes start may 10, five to 7pm Pacific, and run every Tuesday night through june 14. There is limited space, so sign up now by going to be sproutable.com/teens I will have the link in the show notes. Shoot me an email if you have any questions. The other thing I want to tell you about I'm super excited I will be in Alexandria Virginia in May. Are you in or around that area? Are you close to Alexandria Virginia? The positive discipline association is putting on a conference may 26 an all day conference there. And I'm one of the. Speakers. I'm gonna talk about deans. I would love to meet you there. I would love to meet you in person. And if you are interested, there's gonna be a link in the show notes to get you to that conference. But if you're interested, also in being a parent educator, if you're someone who's like, Yeah, I wonder what it would be like to support families in my area, if you are already supporting families and looking to fine tune, you know the philosophy that you're holding, if you're looking for a certification program for supporting parents with positive discipline, I am doing a live in person parent education training in McLean, just outside of Alexandria, on May, 27 and 28th so the conference is the 26th and then the 27th and 28th I'll be leading an in person certification training, two days deep diving into the activities and the facilitation of positive discipline that will certify people, certify participants in being positive discipline parent educators, super cool. So again, in the show notes, Rowan's gonna drop the details and the links on all the things, on the parenting class, on the PDA conference and on the parent educator training, she's gonna drop all those links in the show notes. All right, yay. I'm so excited, as you can tell by all the things that are coming up. So thanks for hanging in there and listening to all of that. I am so glad that you're here. I know that you're gonna love my guest as much as I loved her. Speaking of meeting people in Alexandria, I'm really hoping I get to meet her there. Enjoy this show, my friends. You

all right, hi listeners. Welcome back to the podcast. I'm so excited to introduce you to this week's guest, Charlotte Avery. Charlotte is an author, speaker and entrepreneur who is fiercely committed to helping women go from overwhelmed to overjoyed in their role as wives and moms as the family strategist. She draws upon her experiences as the wife of one, the mother of seven and owner of no pets. Love that part to give moms the tools they need to define for themselves what it means to have it all. As a mom of seven, Charlotte became consumed by her children's needs and lost touch with her identity, but when she learned how to blend instead of balance her life, Charlotte was able to make time for herself, which helped her reconnect with who she was now as the family strategist, Charlotte helps all moms do the same, teaching them how to love themselves, strengthen their families, live authentically and do it in style. You can find more about her at being Charlotte. Avery.com Hi Charlotte. Welcome to the podcast.

Charlotte Avery 7:56
Hi Casey. I'm so excited to be here.

Casey O'Roarty 7:59
I am so glad that you're here too. And I was just saying before I hit record, I Well, I didn't say this, but I totally have stocked your Instagram account and your family, each one of your seven kids, like the individuality, the uniqueness, the gorgeousness, like it is amazing to deep dive into your family. So let the listeners know, who are your kids, what are their ages? Tell us about them, and you have seven. Oh, my

Charlotte Avery 8:29
God, I have seven children, no twins, and I have my oldest is 18. So let me just go. Let me see if I can, like, sometimes I forget, like, I'm like, whose birthday is when? Okay, so I have 18 year old, a 17 year old, a 15 year old, a 13 year old, a 12 year old, a 10 year old and an eight year old. That's going on 38 oh my gosh. And I have four girls and three boys.

Casey O'Roarty 8:56
And what are the what's the order like? Where do the boys fall? My

Charlotte Avery 9:00
oldest is a boy, then I have three girls, and then two boys, and then Isabelle. Was the tiebreaker, yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 9:09
oh my gosh. And did you come from a big family? Like, how did this happen? I mean, I know how it happened, but was that the plan to have a huge family?

Charlotte Avery 9:17
So Casey people ask me that all the time. And here's the thing, is that a rude question, by the way, I mean, because, you know, sometimes people like, Well, I came from a big family, so I wanted to have a big family. And some people like, I came from a big family, and I don't want a big family, right, right? But my husband is actually an only child, and he wanted a big family, and then I have one fully biological sibling. So when we met and everything, it was like, at first I didn't even want to have kids, like, when I thought about my life, I was like, I'm just so busy doing all these other amazing things, and I didn't want to have kids. But I don't know, God just kind of changed my heart, and I ended up getting married to this amazing guy, and we were like, Okay, let's have four kids. Maybe. Five, and then ended up having seven. And actually, I wanted to adopt some kids. I didn't really think that all of my kids would come through my womb, but here they are. So, yeah, oh

Casey O'Roarty 10:10
my gosh. Like, right now you're in adolescence. I mean, and even the younger two are well on their way towards adolescence, which I know I see your face, like, Oh, God, but at one point you had seven under 10, yeah. I mean, like, to me, the little like, corralling the little ones is what really blows my mind. Yes, thinking about that. And like, yeah, grocery store and like, so talk about, you know, when they were little. And in your bio, just your story of kind of losing touch with your identity and like, what is happening right now. So where did that fall in the timeline of growing your family?

Charlotte Avery 10:51
So when we first had Lim, you know, that's my oldest son, Lim, when we had Lynn, well, you know, I felt like I was doing all the right things, as far as, like, you know, not getting pregnant again or whatever. But you know, who knew that I would like to come to the lie that when you nurse your children, that you are getting pregnant and or

Casey O'Roarty 11:11
that you lose a ton of weight by nursing your children like, that's the other Yeah.

Charlotte Avery 11:15
And so what happened was, Lim was four and a half months old. When I found out I was pregnant with Abigail, and I was like, what, like, how did this happen? Even though I knew how it would happen. But I was like, Oh my gosh. And so good

Casey O'Roarty 11:31
for you for wanting to put out, because I was still not even I was like, No, I'm good,

Charlotte Avery 11:38
right? And so I was like, Oh my gosh, but you know, so what happened was my husband ended up, after having my daughter, my husband ended up getting an opportunity for us to move to California. And when we moved to California, I tell people I had God rod and my children, right? And so I didn't know that when I got there I was going to end up getting pregnant again. So after getting pregnant, we actually lost that particular baby. But then I got pregnant again after that, and I think it was, like, right around the time when I was living in California with no support system and anything like that, and I was just like, Okay, I was doing what I call the whams, the What about me? You know, like, you

Casey O'Roarty 12:18
have three at this point. You have three, like, under four years old, right? Yes,

Charlotte Avery 12:22
yes. And then, you know, like, the whole potty training situation was, like, a whole nother thing. And my mom was living on the East Coast. My husband's family is on the east coast. And I was just like, trying to, like, grasp for straws. But then I was just kind of like, you know, there were so many other things that I was doing before I got married. You know, I have a master's degree in sports medicine. And so I was doing all these amazing things before I met my husband, and then, you know, after I had kids, I was just kind of feeling like, gosh, you know, I really want something that really has nothing to do with them, you know, I'm like, Okay, I'm breastfeeding, I'm doing all these things. I'm tending to, you know, my husband and my kids. And I was just like, wham, like, what about me? Like, you know, and I just felt like I was kind of like on this island by myself. And you know, sometimes as moms, we feel like that, you know, we feel like we're just on this motherhood journey by ourselves. And I call it like being out in the motherhood streets, but you're really not in the motherhood streets by yourself. And so I really needed to find something that fulfilled me. And so right after I had my third I ended up writing my first book called no one ever told me witty, practical and spiritual truths about motherhood. And I wrote that book because I was like, man, there's so many things that I'm learning about motherhood, even though my children were small, that no one ever told me. And so that's actually how I kind of started my author journey and my entrepreneurship journey and things like that, and then I started filling myself with things that really had to do with what fulfilled me, even though sometimes it was they coincided with my family. But it was like my thing, I was growing a business. I was helping my husband grow business, but, you know, I was starting to grow my thing. I mean, I totally had to reinvent myself, you know, after knowing that I wasn't going to go back and do the same type of work that I was doing before. Mm,

Casey O'Roarty 14:12
hmm. So talk about writing a book. Had you been like, writing a blog? And you thought, yeah, I can make this into a book, or just out of nowhere. You were like, I have some shit to say. Like, yes, that all of that. I

Charlotte Avery 14:25
was like, I have for you. I have stuff to say. I was like, mad at my mom. I'm like, girl, you should have told me this stuff, and you didn't. And so since you didn't tell me, and other moms didn't tell me, I'm gonna spill the beads and tell everybody else. And yeah, and so I wasn't even into blogging or anything. Yet, I was just like, I want to write this book, and I want to help other moms, and I want to let them live their best, help them to live their best. Pregnant mom fulfilled lives, you know, or whatever. And I just wanted to, also, you know, help moms to get the joy back. Because I knew what it was to be overwhelmed, to have so many things. Things to do, to take care of so many people and all of that, even though I was only taking care of three at the time. But here's the thing, by the time we moved from, you know, back on the east coast, from California, then I was pregnant with number four, and so it was like, I mean literally, Casey. Can I tell you? Like, I really just realized not too long ago that a decade of my life was spent bearing children.

Casey O'Roarty 15:23
Listen, Isn't that wild? Yes, that is wild. I was like, Oh

Charlotte Avery 15:29
my gosh. And then one day my husband, he was like, You know what? I met these people and they had like, three kids back to back. And I was like, Okay. And he was like, No. Like, every year I'm like, Uh huh. I'm like, not impressed, like a kid in 2007 2008 and 2009 right? And he was like, oh yeah. But you know, let me just say this too, for all those moms who feel like, you know what, my clock is ticking and I don't know when I'm going to have kids, I just want you to know all your listeners. I want them to know that I had my first child at 30.

Casey O'Roarty 16:00
Oh, good for you. We're the same age.

Charlotte Avery 16:04
I had my first child at 30, and my daughter Isabelle, who was the tiebreaker. She was born in September, and then two months later, I turned 40. You

Casey O'Roarty 16:23
some of my very best friends became moms at 40, and my sister just had a baby at 40. Well, and it's funny too, because how quickly we put ourselves in other people well, there's I have a couple things to say. One, I remember having my first having my little baby, Rowan. And I was a teacher, but I was had a nice, long leave of absence, and so I'd go up to the little school that I taught at and visit with people, with my little baby, and I remember my sweet friend Andre coming over and peeking in and just saying, isn't it the most amazing experience? And my eyes filled with tears, and I said, this is really hard. This is really hard. And I noticed, like, every time some little old lady or some person wanted to come over and just say, cherish every moment. You know, the days are long, the years are short. In those early months, I was just like, quit with that. Like, this is hard, and now I feel bad. And then I saw Oprah did this whole episode titled The Myth of motherhood, that is all about how I was feeling. And I remember catching that and being like, Oh, I'm not this freaky person who's like, I mean, I adored my child, and I wore her and I nursed her, and I was, you know, all the things, which was fine. I was totally down to be an attached parent and all the things. And I wasn't just like luxuriating in joy the whole time.

Charlotte Avery 17:53
I think, listen. I feel you. I feel you completely. Because there were times when people were talking to me and I just wanted to say the SH word. I just want to say, shut up. Yeah, don't talk to me. You have no idea you are not walking in my shoes. Today is not a good day. And the thing is, I, you know, I tell people all the time, especially like my clients who deal with a lot of mommy guilt, I say, You know what? I threw mommy guilt out of the door, you know, at child number three, because there is the reality of motherhood, and people don't understand what that is. I mean, it's, you know, not only did your body and everything change over these nine months, but people don't tell you how miserable and tired you are. That really almost like that first year, you

Casey O'Roarty 18:38
know, five, and they become teenagers, and it's like, oh, now I don't get to sleep again. Great, teenage

Charlotte Avery 18:43
thing. And we're going to have to talk about that, because, let me tell you, teenagers are a whole nother playing field. Yeah, like, raising teenagers is not for the faint of heart,

Casey O'Roarty 18:54
not if you're paying attention, like, not if you're in it to win it. I mean, there's, you know? And I said to my husband. I think it was yesterday. I was like, You know what? I love our kids. I know we don't have much more time, and I'm really looking forward to not having to manage. You know, even though the management is so different and so much less than when they were little, and they would rather I didn't manage. And that's a whole other conversation around balance too, but Well, we'll see as I move through it, and actually, as I'm seeing with my clients, it's like, oh, the myth of the launch and, like, that's all of a sudden, like, okay, great, I don't have to worry about you anymore. Like, I realize that's not a true thing, but I'm looking forward to a little bit of distance. I'm looking forward to visits and times together and times apart. And, you know, again, it's like, even as I listen to myself say that there is, like, on the outskirts, a little bit of like, How can you say that? Like, why aren't you? You know, I did not cry when my kids went to kindergarten. I was not like, pining away for the elementary years, like, I'm okay. With every step of the way, it's all good, right?

Charlotte Avery 20:03
Yes. So I only cried when a couple of my kids went to kindergarten, and then I think it was really like the last one. When Isabelle went it was like a whole nother, like, cycle of life, because I'm like, she's the last one, yeah, you know, and at least I think she's the last Well, we'll

Casey O'Roarty 20:20
see. Don't move.

Charlotte Avery 20:23
But you know, I'm like, she's the last one and then. But you know what? I was so excited and sad at the same time. But my excitement came from the fact that now all of my kids were in school, and now all of the other hopes and dreams that I had not seen come to fruition yet, because I just felt like, you know, the time was what it was that now I was like, I have no excuse to not really dig in and press into really, like, all of my gifts and talents and, you know, really motivating women and doing all the things I did. And so it gave me time. I mean, once my kids went to school, I had time to, you know, do TV interviews and write more books, and, you know, all of that. And I'm like, okay, drop them off at school. I've got this eight to three hour window to do whatever I need to do for my business.

Casey O'Roarty 21:09
So long at first, right? You're like, hours, and then, oh,

Charlotte Avery 21:13
and then you already, and they're home. I'm like, Where'd

Casey O'Roarty 21:17
you come hungry? Yes. So you we're going to talk about the work that you do with women. We're going to talk about mama mental health. So you do all sorts of things with people, so family management to career strategizing. I love your website. You work on personal growth, and I love the way all of those things can intertwine and influence our mental health. So, you know, I mean, we can't, not talk about the water that we're swimming in right now, right? Pandemic, you know, unstable world politics. What have you seen, plus, like we have children, right? What have you seen with the clients that you serve? What's been coming up for people? What are they having a tough time with

Charlotte Avery 22:01
my clients are having a tough time with overwhelm. Because, especially like the moms that I work with that, you know, before the pandemic, you know, there were women who were working outside the home, and then I had clients who were still working inside the home, or, you know, their stay at home moms, well, when the pandemic hit now, these moms who were working, you know, they were used to getting up in the morning, sending their kids off to school and then leaving and going to work, or, you know, depending on their lifestyle, either they were, you know, out of the house before their kids went to work, I mean, went to school, or what have you now, when the pandemic Started, these moms now became they weren't just mom. They were virtual schoolers. You know. They were teaching their children how to virtual school and do all of these different things. Their work schedules had to shift. I mean, the workplace for women, I think, shifted more than anything during the pandemic, you know? And then, you know, one thing that I found to be really beautiful was the fact of women who were like now they had been home with their children, and now they started setting like boundaries for their employers to say, if you want me to come back into the workplace like in the office, then these are the parameters that need to be in place for me to even consider coming back there. Because now they found the value in the fact that time really mattered. Like, if the pandemic didn't teach us anything, it hopefully taught us how precious time is. And I'm talking about time with the people who you love the most. But what I found is women always ask me, they're like, Charlotte, like, how are you doing this? Like, I mean, here's the one thing I heard all the time, I only have two kids. How are you virtual schooling seven? You know, for me, it was like so in part of my motherhood journey, I homeschooled two of my children while the others were still in school, and then a couple of them hadn't gone to school yet. But anyway, for me, it was easy for me to flip back into kind of sort of homeschool mode, even though it was virtual school, because I just knew how to reset up my household. So when the pandemic started, moms were like, you know, how do I set up my house? You know, to be a comfortable and safe place where I can actually still do my own work, right, but still have my kids in a earshot of me, making sure that they're okay, even from internet predators, because they had to be on the internet so much,

Casey O'Roarty 24:23
right, right? Starts to spin. There's just sitting ducks, yeah.

Charlotte Avery 24:28
And then it's like, okay, so now you're at home with your children all day. And at least the moms who were, you know, working outside of the home, they still had that window that they weren't with their kids before their kids were actually driving them crazy my school, right, you know. And so I tell people all the time, like, you know, how people have this conversation of, you know, is it better to stay at home with your kids versus going to work? Well, I just believe in seasons of life, and I believe that staying home with your kids is not for everybody, because I feel like, if it's going to make you a better parent, and you're going to serve your children and your family. Better to leave your home and go to work and do what fulfills you outside of your home, so that you can be better for your family when you come back home, more power to you. So to me, there's no argument in that you have to do what's best for you. Yes, 100% my kids, I tell you, one of the hardest things for me was the social interaction. You know, when you have a big family like mine, I mean, you know, they grow up together, they have each other, but now with the pandemic, and everybody's inside, and we're so nervous, we're nervous Nellies because we don't want to get sick. You know, it was, how was I going to create, you know, moments for my children to still interact with their friends, especially my older kids, who, you know, I mean, we're not a big social media family, like, I have social media because of the work that I do and stuff like that, but my kids were late into getting, you know, social media and stuff like that. My kids were late in getting cell phones because I'm like, Are you calling? You have anybody talk to, you know? But yeah, so my older kids are now just starting to get like, Snapchat or something like that, and it's okay with me, but to feel like, how was I going to bridge those opportunities for them to still have social interaction with people who were outside of their home was really hard, and so this is, let me tell you what we did. We made sure that our children, each of them, all seven of them, had one person who they could go to their house and could come to our house.

Casey O'Roarty 26:23
Good for you. And you guys, everybody was on the plan. Everybody

Charlotte Avery 26:27
was on the plan like they knew what to do, like, whoever's house. I mean, there

Casey O'Roarty 26:31
were no pandemic deniers in the circle. Nope, none,

Charlotte Avery 26:34
you know, and so we just made it work. But, you know, that's awesome. But you know, I mean, whether you're in a pandemic or not, motherhood is hard. It's really hard out in these motherhood streets. It

Casey O'Roarty 26:44
really, it is, it is, you know, it's interesting. I don't know if you get this, but there's definitely perception. You know, I share a lot about my own journey, and you know people, you know, and I'm writing and I'm talking and I'm sharing, you know, all these tips and tools, and, you know, my own kind of thoughts around parenting, and so there's the perception that I have it all together. And maybe there isn't a perception of that now that I'm saying, but I think there is. And, you know, I am so excited this afternoon to go see my therapist, because, you know, the ebbs and the flows for me, I get so enmeshed, and I'm noticing some patterns that I've carried, you know, I make connecting some dots from childhood, like things, you know, they don't tell you about motherhood. You have baggage, right? Like you might think you've done your personal work, and maybe you've done plenty of it, but the layers just keep coming. And so I'm really noticing again and again how difficult it is for me to be with my kids difficult times, yes, and to sit with them as they you know, whether it's pandemic, whether it's friends, school, their mental health, just noticing how gut wrenching it is. And I don't think it needs to be as gut wrenching as it feels in my body. So I'm, you know, the idea that there's people like you to work with, and, you know, shout out to my therapist, mark that I get to see this afternoon. But I think it's really important that we just really are willing to grow in our curiosity of ourselves as well, and to recognize like, okay, whoa, whoa, whoa. Like, I want to fix this so that I feel better. I am making this about me, right?

Charlotte Avery 28:19
Yes. So Casey, can I be very transparent with you? Please do so. Yes, back in 2017 I wrote a book called the 40 day tone of voice, tone down. The subtitle is how to transform your relationships one octave at a time. And the reason why I wrote that book was because I recognized a really ugly, dark spot in my life, and I realized that I was literally like I was going to be the woman or the mom who was going to home wreck my house because I was a yeller. You know, sometimes I tell people I feel like I should, because people like they look at me, they look at my website, they look at my social media, you know, you got it together, and they think that I have it all together. In reality, I really feel like I need to walk up to people and say, Hi, my name is Charlotte. I'm a recovering yeller. And people, they're surprised to know that about me when I say it, you know, but I feel that it's so important to be very honest and real about who we are and our story. You know, because there was a season in my life where I was yelling all of the time, and it impacted my children. It impacted my relationship with my husband, and I can tell you the day that shook me to my core. Two of my daughters were playing together, and my older daughter had my younger daughter back into the corner, berating her, and she was yelling, yelling, yelling, and the hand movements and the body and all of the extra, you know. And I'm a black mom, so I was like, Girl, I'm about to snatch you up, right? And before I could snatch her, I just heard the Lord say, look at yourself, and when your children start to mirror your bad behavior. Oh, Casey, it shook me in a way that I cannot even tell you, and at that point, I said to myself, I have to do better. I have to really dig deep and discover why am I doing this? Where is this coming from? What is the pattern? What are the deep roots that this ugly behavior in me, where does this come from? And I had to do my own work, like you're saying, and yes, like you, you thank God for Mark. I thank God for Tiffany. I thank God for my Tiffany, because she is the one who, when all hell is breaking loose, that I could be like, you know, and I'm calling her, that I can, like, really deal with my own stuff. And I'm telling you, like, I believe that as women and as moms, we try to hide our truth, but there's so much danger in doing that, because it just eats at us to our core, because then we're like, oh, I'm an imposter. I'm dealing with imposter syndrome. I don't want people to find out about me. What if people knew this or whatever? And then my question to myself was, what if people did

Casey O'Roarty 31:25
right? They'd feel normal, right?

Charlotte Avery 31:28
You know? Yeah, you know. And so the thing is, is that when I actually told my story, and I took over 100 and something, people on a journey with me to stop yelling, love it. It was one of the most beautiful experiences I ever had in my life to know that my story was helping not only me, but it was helping other people to really come out and say, You know what, I struggle with this, and I need you to help me with this. And so I just think that there's just so much treasure when you actually speak and tell your truth?

Casey O'Roarty 32:03
Yeah, I totally agree, and I love that you created that, that you wrote that book and created that experience. We'll make sure that I have all the links and everything in the show notes so that people can check it out. And I think too, I want to remind everyone who's listening like the work that Charlotte and I are talking about doing for ourselves is not like a linear well, I'll speak for myself. I am a work in progress, and it is three steps forward, two steps back, three steps forward, two steps back. It's, you know, even just deciding like I'm going to be different, I'm going to do things differently, doesn't mean that every opportunity I have to make that choice. I am regulated enough to even see that there's a choice to make right. And so even in those moments and people that listen, you've heard me say this before, but even those moments where we don't get it right, and we kind of go back to the old ways, there is such rich opportunity there to model personal responsibility and accountability and making things right with our kids, and talking about our process. And, you know, I think like even my son. So just two days ago, he came home in a mood, totally hangry, made himself something to eat. Wanted to go straight downstairs, and I'm feeling this like disconnection with him, and so I'm like, No, how about you eat up here? How about this? How about this? How about that? I don't want to, and he's just kind of a little bit snarky, having a hard time. Well, I just didn't really like that, and I slid right into, you can be in a bad mood, but you do not get to treat the rest of us blah blah blah blah blah, blah, blah, blah blah. And I'm talking, and I'm talking, and he's sitting there, and he's looking at me, and in the end, I literally Charlotte growled at him. I was like, ah, and then I walked away, right? I walked away. And I was just like, God, you know. And then he was getting ready to leave. He managed to get out of the house without seeing me, and so I followed him out. And I was like, Hey, I wanted to say goodbye. Sorry about the growl. And he was like, Mom, you are in a bad mood sometimes, and we all have to deal with it. And I came home and I just needed a little downtime. I haven't had any all day, and you got all up in my grill about it. He's like, it's not fair. And in that moment, I got to sit inside of the feedback and recognize like, you're right, yeah, right, you're absolutely right, and I have deeper awareness of that, and I love you. Drive safe. I'll see you later, and it's fine, like it's been fine. We haven't had to hash it out. We haven't had to talk about respect and backdock and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, because I was willing. And I do think my own superpower is I am willing to take the feedback right, even when it's really hard. And I want to be like, well, actually, this is how it is. This is the environment that I want to create for my teenagers. I want them to be able to express here's my. My experience of you, in a way, and he delivered it very honestly and respectfully. And he was like, Listen, this is the situation, mom. Like, hello, and you know, I think it's so powerful, especially with our teenagers. And I know you know this because you live with so many of them like to have a space for that emotional honesty, yes, two way emotional honesty, where they know you're gonna listen and hear yes and take the feedback, I think, is such a powerful piece of this overall mental health conversation.

Charlotte Avery 35:36
I really agree with that Casey, because you know you're talking about your superpower and being able to take that feedback. And one thing that I found so beautiful when you were just telling me about your interaction with your son is the fact that there's so much beauty and so much power and apology. And sometimes as parents, we take the attitude, well, I'm the parent and you're the child and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, and we just like, dig in and dig in and dig in and we harp and we harp and we harp. But when we can take a step back and say, You know what, I'm sorry I was wrong, you are entitled to have a bad day. Maybe I should have questioned before I you know all that, why your day was the way it was, or what have you. But you know, I even find with my children that, you know, because, like, You're right as parents, we don't get it right all the time. I mean, Lord knows, we don't Right, yeah, oh my gosh. But when you do create an environment as a parent, to say, You know what, you can be honest with me, even about me, when your children, even when they're eight years old or 18 years old or whatever, when your children actually hear you say, I'm not always right. I think the first time my children heard that, they were like, Oh my gosh, like, what? But when you give that space to your kids and you say, You know what, you can tell me anything. You can tell me anything good or bad, even about myself, even if I hurt your feelings, just be respectful. That's like. The caveat for our kids is, be respectful, yeah, you know, please tell the truth and love, and then let's be able to work through it. I just say, you know, for parents, definitely create those spaces and those opportunities, because we are not always right. We do miss the mark. I probably miss it like Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, until Friday and Saturday get here, you know, I don't know, yeah, but yeah, I just wanted to say that was beautiful between you and your son.

Casey O'Roarty 37:32
Thank you. Thank you. You.

Um, so back to mental health, yes.

So as you work with clients who are feeling that overwhelm, and maybe they've got, you know, the teenagers doing their thing, or younger kids doing their thing, and it feels like they're drowning, what are some of the tools that you use. And I loved when we were talking about, everybody has to be online school now, and like creating the physical environment for that, we're working actually right now. I'm putting in a breakfast nook in our kitchen, because we don't have it's just kind of this wonky setup, and there's nowhere to hang out, really. And so I'm like, You know what? We need a hangout area in the kitchen, and so we're working on that. And like thinking about the physical environment as a place for being together and gathering together or learning what are some other things like when you work with clients around just wanting to find that blend. I love that your bio it's not about balance. It's about blend. What are some of the things that you support them with?

Charlotte Avery 38:47
So I do support them in creating quiet spaces, not only for the people in their household, but for themselves. So I will be very honest with you, Casey, I don't even take on clients if they can't commit to at least one hour a week to do something by themselves, for themselves, because I just know that there's so much peace and there's so much value in being able to remove your own self from your family, whether it's going to get a cup of coffee, whether it's closing your door and just sinking into a bubble bath or whatever, but to even just leave your household and leave your environment so that you can come back and be a happier, healthier person for yourself, but then for them, and then, you know, just also teaching children how to respect the time when mom and or dad has set aside their own personal time, because, you know, I mean, let's just be real. We're born in narcissism, right? I mean, it's all about us and all these things, and so we have to teach our children how to even respect our quiet time, you know, our private time. So like, if I leave the house, whether I'm going to hang out with my friends and to do something that fulfills me, i. Say, I'm going to be gone for this particular amount of time. Your dad is here. Do not call me. You know, it's really about setting those boundaries. But also, like, I love how you said they're doing the breakfast nook and things like that in our home, people would probably think, oh, where can anybody go in your house? Because you've got so many people, right? But, I mean, the thing is, is that our entire basement is for our children. So they know that they can go downstairs and there are mats down there. They can roll around, they can play, they can run, they can play basketball. Downstairs in the basement, they know where their space is and where they can actually kind of steal away, turn up their music, and really just finding the things that really allow them to find their own joy. Some of my children are artists and things like that. So, you know, we had to, like, get paint and all kinds of art supplies and things like that, so that they could just really be creative, you know, breaking away and doing all of those things. But for my clients, I always saying, you know, like, do yourself a favor and do your family a favor and give yourself time to take space, because we all need that. And I always say this therapy is good. Yes, therapy has been one of the best things in my life, from when my father passed, to my yelling journey to just being a wife and a mom or whatever, one of the best things that I could ever do for myself was to find a therapist that I could just throw up on,

Casey O'Roarty 41:28
mm hmm, shout out to Tiffany and mark yes and not

Charlotte Avery 41:33
apologize for it, you know, but I could just say, You know what? Today has really been a crappy day, and you know, this happened last week, and I need to vent about this, because your therapist is also your safe space. For me, my therapist really helps to keep me in a place in my own self, where I'm not going back to being my yelling self, you know. So you know, first of all, you've got to ask yourself, what is it that's making you so overwhelmed? Yeah, because one thing that I found out in my journey, as far as being a yeller, it was really me feeling the whams of life, the What about me, but also me feeling my own inadequacy of being a wife and a mom and so sometimes, especially if you're type A, oh my gosh, you know, like if you're a type A personality, even if you're not, I think that Every mom goes through, you know, am I good enough? Am I doing enough? And then it's the mommy guilt, and it's all the other things, but you also have to prioritize yourself so that you can be your best self for the people who you're serving, whether it's in your workplace, whether it's in your home with your friends, you have to be able to find your joy and be able to take care of you so that you can be good for everybody else. Yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 42:47
when I think about that, I really think about personal growth. For me is non negotiable, like you either grow and learn, and you know, for people who don't have kids, there's other experiences in life that are laying down the lessons for you, right? But for those of us that do have kids and are caretaking kids and in relationship, the choice is either grow or resist, right? And the resistance, I mean, like, who wants to live that life? If it's all about like, I'm right, you're wrong. Everybody is out to get me the blame game like that. Just look, I don't want to live that life. And I think that when we decide, because I do think it's a decision, when we decide to open up, to look inside, to get support, whether it looks like a coach or a therapist or a amazing workshop or whatever, and really start to acknowledge that there is, I mean, I talk about purpose of life, right? We're here to grow and to learn and evolve, right? As humans and having kids, you know, if you've made it to the teen years without really dipping into personal growth? Well, here it comes, right? Because when we can see, like you shared about your daughter in the corner, and like see the mirror that they are, and see what we're passing on, and really ask ourselves, is that what we want? And then, do we want to be the people that we see our kids picking up on, right? Who do we want to be in the world now, when our kids are in the room with us, or later, when they're doing their thing and raising their kids, you know, who do we want to be in these relationships with these people that we love so much? Like, I get so excited about that. I love that. I love personal growth. And I know not everybody's like, yes, let's dig in and roll around in our darkness. But I am here for

Charlotte Avery 44:44
it. I am too. And like you said, you're either going to grow or resist. It's like a plant. You're either going to grow and water yourself, yeah, or you're going to shrivel up and you're going to die and you're going to die internally. You know, your relationships, there are just so many things that we need to water. Ourselves so that we can grow and flourish as we're growing and flourishing. People get to be part of that fruit, you know, because now we become trees that are bearing fruit, and people get to be like, Oh my gosh, how did you do that? Or whatever? And then we not only get to grow and flourish, but as we're growing and flourishing, as Casey's growing and flourishing, yeah, you know, as Charlotte's growing and flourishing, we get to help other people, other moms, grow and flourish. And it's really a beautiful, beautiful thing. And so, you know, I read a lot of self help books, me too, even though I don't have a whole lot of time to read. So sometimes, if I can't read the book, I'll go and get an audio book and I'll just have it playing in my ear, whatever, because I do want to grow. I do want to be better before I become a better wife and a better mom. I want to become a better me, because if I'm not a better me, I'm never going to become a better wife and a better mom. Yeah, I'm never going to become a better coach, a better entrepreneur, if I don't take care of me. And so, you know, when women are like, Oh, I just believe in putting my kids first. I'm like, I don't. And I remember the first time I said that an older woman was, like, shocked and appalled that I said that she was like, you just neglect your children or whatever. I

Casey O'Roarty 46:11
think, yeah, it's amazing, the conclusion people come to, right, like, you know, first of all, you

Charlotte Avery 46:16
think I'm the nanny because I have seven kids, but now you think that I neglect my kid? No, I don't neglect my children. What I do do is I choose to prioritize myself so that I can be better for them. Yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 46:29
and we're talking about moms and for all the dads. I do know there's a handful of dads that listen, and I think all of this is true and valuable for them as well. I agree, right, like 100% and having these conversations with your partner about needs and routine and ritual and how to come together to be the best family team that you can be, and what does that look like and what people need. I think it's just so powerful. And Charlotte, I cannot believe the time right now, because I could talk to you for another hour.

Charlotte Avery 47:01
Oh my gosh. We need to schedule this again. Yes,

Casey O'Roarty 47:06
yes, yes. And I barely, I mean, I kind of dipped into the outline, but not really

Charlotte Avery 47:15
scheduled this again. This is, like the best adult conversation I'll have all done.

Casey O'Roarty 47:20
Yay. We covered a lot. We've just had a great conversation that I really appreciate. Is there anything else you want to make sure listeners leave with? You know,

Charlotte Avery 47:30
I just want your listeners to know that although motherhood is hard, but at the end of it, I just believe that if we give ourselves grace, and we give the people who we love grace, I think we just get to see the beauty in it quicker than we thought. Because, you know, 18 years comes by really fast it does, and you really don't realize how much sometimes when you think you're not doing a good job. I really just want your audience to just go in the mirror and look at themselves and say, You know what? Today didn't go the way that I wanted it to go, but I really did a good job today. Yeah,

Casey O'Roarty 48:08
I love that.

Charlotte Avery 48:09
I really am a good parent. I really am a good mom, like, even though my kids like kick, scream and cry against the things that I do sometimes, I really am a good parent.

Casey O'Roarty 48:21
I love that. What does joyful courage mean to you? Charlotte,

Charlotte Avery 48:26
Oh, wow. Joyful courage to me, it means being able to find the joy even in the scary moments. It really does, because, I mean, even right now, like I'm living in that space right now, especially with my son, who he's going to be our first to leave home and go to college, and as nervous as I feel, as you know, the trepidation that I have, just knowing, you know what I'm going to be a courageous mom, letting him spread his wings and fly, because it takes courage for us to do that, but also finding the joy in his journey, yeah, and in my journey, as we're going down this path

Casey O'Roarty 49:11
together. So yeah, is he looking at schools close by? Some

Charlotte Avery 49:15
of them are close by, and some of them are not so close. And I'm okay with that, yeah, the reason why I'm okay with it is because I really feel like I may not have taught him everything, but I do believe that I've taught him the right things. Yeah, able to leave home and spread his wings and fly and be an incredible person in the world. Yes,

Casey O'Roarty 49:33
yeah, my son, my 16 year old, when he talks about college, he's like, out of state, out of state, out of state. So anyway, okay, yay, yay, yay. So people can find you at being Charlotte Avery,

Charlotte Avery 49:46
because I can only be myself. You can only

Casey O'Roarty 49:49
be yourself. We'll have that link in the show notes. So you've got books you work with clients. Do you have, like, workshops and courses and things like that? What else do

Charlotte Avery 49:57
you got? They can find all of my books, and they can schedule. Time with me. On Being Charlotte avery.com they can see all of my craziness and foolishness on my Instagram and Facebook. Follow Charlotte Avery also, and on LinkedIn, I'm Charlotte e Avery, great.

Casey O'Roarty 50:12
Yay. Thank you so much. This was so awesome. They can't wait so we get to chat again.

Charlotte Avery 50:18
Thank you so much for having me. Casey. I look forward to sharing more time and space with you again.

Casey O'Roarty 50:30
Okay, thank you so much for listening in. I just adore this community. I'm so happy to bring you conversations that matter, right? Conversations that matter. We have some really fun things coming up on the podcast and beyond. So again, check the show notes. And are you on my email list? If you're not go to be sproutable.com/teens, get signed up now so you stay up to date on all the things that are going on. You can sign up for seven tips over seven days, an email support program that will help you in nurturing stronger connection with your tweens and teens. And if you again feel inspired and you haven't already, do me a favor and leave that five star review on Apple podcast. It is so useful for this show, as far as being seen and heard so, yeah, that would be amazing. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you to the team at sproutable. Love you Juliet and Alana. Thank you Rowan for taking care of the show notes and the social media and Chris. Thank you so much for you and your team at podshaper.com so appreciate your editing and making the show sounds so good. I am honored you all. I am honored that you listen each week. We are all doing the best we can in the moment that includes you. Have a beautiful week. I'll see you next time

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